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THEY'RE TEARING DOWN THE DAME, BUSTERS,etc!
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elzie5000
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not only do people not like garages or underground parking, the people here suck at using them. Have you ever seen how beat up the columns are in the garages downtown from people hitting them?

I still don't think underground parking is possible at CenterePointee. It has been in the plans for at least a dozen buildings and never happens because of the geology under downtown.

It's also worth asking whether those millions might be better spent on downtown public transportation. Trolleys? Streetcars?

Pedcabs!

The first public hearing about a CentrePointe TIF was held after Tuesday's task force meeting. It was lightly attended, and only a handful of citizens spoke. Maybe that was because it's early in the process, and people have little information to react to.

The idealistic have realized (temporarily) that their input doesn't matter. Hearings like that are for 'feel good' purposes only. Anything they come up with gets ignored.

Last night at the Dame:
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brokebike
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Our elected city officials have provided a great forum for discussing these issues. They, and Lexington citizens, should make the most of it — and soon.


Perhaps those great forums could've been utilized say, oh maybe 2 years ago when rumors over this project first started to swirl....

...and then also even before Centrepointe was unveiled as a done deal to the public?

Call me crazy, but screw our city officials, and screw the Webbs. Lexington citizens' opinions and input do not mean a damn in this, so who are they trying to fool?
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mcrib
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I feel like Jim Grey is the one possible exception.
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davem
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is the 2nd (of 4) emails that Newberry has sent this week to share his opinions of CentrePointe. This one discusses the supposed "myths" that came about in the negotiations about the development. I guess by "myths", he means "concerns of the public about what happens in their city". I'm not really appreciating his over-simplification and condescending tone. I do appreciate Vice Mayor Gray and how outspoken he has been. Hopefully he isn't just working a hidden agenda.

Quote:
Myths and Realities of Centrepointe

Now, in light of recent decisions by the Courthouse Area Design Review Board, Fayette Circuit Court and the Urban County Council's delegation to negotiate tax increment financing ("TIF") with the developers, the project is moving forward, and construction will most likely soon begin. However, multiple downtown projects are being considered by both public and private entities, so before those projects roll forward, now is an opportune time to evaluate some of the myths and the realities of the Centrepointe debate.

Myth #1
LFUCG has the right to dictate building design. The reality is that, except in historic districts, LFUCG has virtually no input on design of private developments anywhere in the community, including downtown. The Courthouse Area Design Review Board reviews proposed designs in a small area surrounding the old courthouse in accordance with adopted design guidelines. That Board found unanimously that the Centrepointe project satisfied all of those design requirements.

Myth #2
There was no opportunity for public input. The reality is that there have been and will be both formal and informal opportunities for public input. Informally, developers and opponents of the project met repeatedly, including one meeting attended by hundreds of people at the Kentucky Theatre and one held in the Urban County Council Chambers. The blogs, op-ed pieces and letters provided others informal opportunities for public discussion of the project. In addition, a formal public hearing lasting 5 hours was conducted before the Courthouse Area Design Review Board. Further, state law requires the Council to conduct a hearing on any TIF proposal, and the Council's TIF delegation has a public meeting scheduled tonight at 6 PM in the Council Chambers on TIF issues.

Myth #3
TIF financing constitutes a $70 million subsidy for the developers. The reality is that the developers receive none of the TIF funds. By statute, TIF can only be used for public improvements - streets, sewers, improvements to public buildings, and similar public projects. In short, TIF permits Lexington to make public improvements using the new state tax dollars generated by increased economic activity within a specified geographic area. TIF permits Lexington to keep those new state tax dollars, all of which would otherwise go straight to Frankfort. There should be a vigorous debate over which public projects should be funded, but there should be no debate over whether to pursue TIF for projects whenever TIF is financially feasible. Lexington's infrastructure sorely needs to be overhauled, and TIF is a wonderful way to finance those badly needed public improvements in multiple areas of our city.

Myth #4
All old buildings are worthy of preservation and contribute to the authenticity of Lexington. The reality is that some old structures are critically important to the community, and some are not. The worst possible time to debate the historic significance of structures is when someone is proposing that one be demolished. Perspective is lost. Emotions are high. Community interests are distorted. Instead, Lexington should inventory its historic buildings now, and identify those that have historical significance. Generally speaking, those buildings should be saved whenever possible. Others should be recognized as structures which may be razed without delay.

Myth #5
The Farmers' Market will be destroyed. The reality is that the Farmers' Market has been looking to relocate for more than a year. The farmers want a permanent facility, and Vine Street, however wonderful its ambiance may be, can never satisfy that need. Thus, Centrepointe's announcement was not the beginning of the end for the Farmers' Market, but it has accelerated efforts to address a longstanding need to find or build a permanent structure. Ideally, the market will be located in the downtown area where coffee shops, restaurant and other retail establishments can benefit from the shoppers drawn by local farmers.[
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brokebike
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

if these really are written by Newberry himself, as I doubt they are... I have even less respect for the guy.

This reeks of some really bad, hired-on PR campaign... like "Webb-level" bad. Oh wait, they're not interested in things like public relations.

Someone should tell Newberry he needs to fire his bush league apologist, whoever they might be lurking in the shadows.
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brokebike
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 9:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lately, I've been getting increasingly concerned by the cultural fallout from the Centrepointe debacle...

CURRENT AND POTENTIAL FUTURE CITY LEADERS IF YOU ARE READING THIS PLEASE TAKE NOTE:

Today I heard from yet another good friend who told me he has decided to leave Lexington for something better. His reasons were equal parts economic and cultural. I've heard of several since the Centrepointe "go ahead", that have made plans to leave Lexington, admittedly due to the deep discouragement and resentment caused by the decisions of our city leaders. It makes me wonder... in my own small circle of influence in this town, if I know this many people who are packing up and leaving because of this cultural-shifting event, how many others are out there in the same situation?

Any of my close friends will tell you that I have always been a staunch defender of Lexington and my rooted belief that you shouldn't just move to where you think the grass is greener when things get stale and stagnant. Instead, you stick it out, and try your best to make where you are the place you want it to ultimately be. When you see a void, you fill it. When you see an opportunity to contribute, you do so. This is the essence of community involvement and shaping the way things change.

Lately, this whole sad episode in Lexington's history has made me feel like a fool for believing in the things that I have always held true. How can I not fault or blame others for wanting to move on? When a mayor is elected under the promise of making Lexington a better place - rallying the young and progressive for change in this town, only to end up towing the line for the old way of doing things - how can you NOT feel like things are ever going to change here?

The only tangible opposition to the Centrepointe plan, as admirable as it was, argued mainly for the buildings themselves and NOT so much the culture and community whose ideals were firmly rooted in the businesses those buildings served, or the essence that they fostered. I think the latter could've been a much more convincing sticking point had it been stressed enough, but who's to say in this black and white world where people only see that which is tangible (i.e. the validity of a building's history)?

By catering to, and falling victim to the outdated ideals and empty promises of twenty years ago, Lexington has effectively reset itself back twenty years. When it comes time for people to wonder why, someone can tell them that they traded some magic beans and 900 service worker jobs for the pride, talent and creativity of a population of young adults who simply wanted to believe that they lived in a cool town that had finally opened its eyes.

But that never happened.
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Last edited by brokebike on Fri Aug 15, 2008 4:33 pm; edited 1 time in total
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mcrib
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a conversation with a friend who calls Boulder, CO. home and posed the question that if you are really strong in your convictions does it do any good to live within a community where people, for the most part, agree with you. I argued that if you really feel strongly in your beliefs that you need to live on the front lines where those beliefs are far from the norm. Lexington has been and is become more and more that kind of place. The centerpointe fiasco has done severe damage to moral in Lexington. I myself have felt considerable depression over the way the entire ordeal was handled. I feel betrayed by many of our supposed leaders and by many of lexington's citizenry. But instead of marking the end of our struggle to realize a modern, progressive Lexington where we can feel real pride about where we live I think this ordeal has taught us the need for better organization, more money and more lawyers which is unfortunate. But to roll over at this point is not necessary. I realize, on a personal level, that there is a lot more I can do to improve this place I call home. but at the same time set backs always hurt. esp. one this huge.
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elzie5000
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The slumlord closed his pawn shop today. Look for the rest of the buildings to start coming down soon. Maybe tonight, maybe Monday.

Unless someone burns them down first. Then they'd be a crime scene.
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jkizzle
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 16, 2008 11:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

elzie5000 wrote:

Unless someone burns them down first. Then they'd be a crime scene.


now that would put a twist on things.
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elzie5000
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 16, 2008 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I should not be allowed near a computer while drunk. Now I have to have an alibi 24/7 until they are torn down.
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elzie5000
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Dame and the pawn shop are falling right now.
I have particles of them in my hair, eyes and lungs.

Irony = frat boys from one of the bars across Mill cheering as parts of the pawn shop crashed onto the sidewalk 50 feet away.

It was also the third time I've run into Pat lately and hardly spoken to him. Because apparently I'm rude like that. Sorry.
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mcrib
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 7:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I rode by last night they spray water on one side to keep the dust down but on the other side they just say fuck it. it was pretty bad. also they had main street shut down for traffic b/c shit was falling in the street.
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elzie5000
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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brokebike
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

so Busters is (was) the last man standing?
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elzie5000
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I left at 11 they were working towards the corner from both sides. I don't know how far they got before they stopped for the night.
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